Legislature(1997 - 1998)
02/13/1997 03:03 PM House HES
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
HB 45 - RUNAWAY AND MISSING MINORS Number 0047 REPRESENTATIVE PETE KELLY, sponsor of HB 45, "An Act relating to runaway and missing minors." was first to testify. He said HB 45 provides a technical correction to an error which occurred when his comprehensive rewrite of the juvenile code was combined with Senator Steve Frank's legislation on runaways. When the two bills were combined after the legislative session, a core piece of Senator Frank's legislation was lost and the revisor of the bills needs legislation to fix the problem. REPRESENTATIVE KELLY said HB 45 returns to a parent or guardian the decision to allow an unemancipated minor to remain on the streets or to require the minor to return home. A runaway minor should not have the right of refusal as to where the minor should live, this decision should lie with the minor's parent, legal guardian or in remote cases with a peace officer. Number 0121 REPRESENTATIVE KELLY referred to the bill, page 1, line 11, and read, "where the minor was found and if the minor and the minor's parent or guardian consent". He said that "minor" was left in when the two bills were combined. He stated again that it was just a technical glitch and said he doesn't understand all the workings of the revisor of statutes but clarified that it certainly wasn't their intent last year to leave that section in there. He said Senator Frank's bill, SB 289, was voted on and passed near unanimously last year. He said HB 45 will bring us back to the original intent. Number 0194 REPRESENTATIVE FRED DYSON asked if provision (c), page 2, provided an option of the minor being taken to a secure facility. Number 0242 REPRESENTATIVE KELLY said the minor can be taken to a semi-secure facility. Number 0246 REPRESENTATIVE DYSON asked if the minor still has the option to leave if the minor chooses to do so. Number 0254 REPRESENTATIVE KELLY said according to the original bill, SB 289, when the minor left the semi-secure facility he became a Child in Need of Aid (CINA). He said it corrected a lot of problems with minors being able to leave a facility with complete impunity. When the minor became a CINA, the state could take further action, whereas before there was nothing in statute to address this issue. Number 0297 REPRESENTATIVE DYSON asked if HB 45 could be amended so that it compels the state to take further action if the minor leaves the facility where they have been deposited. Number 0316 REPRESENTATIVE KELLY said this was addressed in SB 289, the state was compelled to take further action. Number 0332 CHAIRMAN BUNDE said in HB 45 they are taken to a semi-secure facility and if the minor leaves, then they fall under provisions of the previous bill, SB 289, which says they are now a CINA and then those provisions would kick in. The minor would be picked up as a CINA and are no longer allowed the flexibility that they are allowed under this bill. Number 0359 REPRESENTATIVE KELLY said it appeared that Representative Dyson was proposing something other than the intent of the legislation that HB 45 attempts to fix. He said it was just a mistake on the revisor and we want to go back to what the intent was. He said he would buy into some of the suggestions, but he thought they would be more appropriate in a different bill. He said there is a time problem on HB 45 because the statutes won't agree. When the department deals with this now, they worry about legal problems. People are interpreting the statutes differently because it says two things in the statutes. He said HB 45 is a housekeeping bill and said Representative Dyson is talking more about an intent that was already addressed in SB 289. Number 0421 REPRESENTATIVE DYSON said he understood that HB 45 is making a correction to the original intent. He said he is absolutely confused between what Representative Kelly and Representative Bunde said about whether or not the child has a chance to get out of the parent's and the state's jurisdiction if they choose to run away. He said he would pursue this in a different place and away from this committee. Number 0443 CHAIRMAN BUNDE said if a minor runs again after being put in a semi-secure facility, they are then picked up and treated under SB 289 which then puts them under the category of CINA and then the minor is no longer allowed to run again. He said the minor can then go to a secure facility. Number 0480 REPRESENTATIVE KELLY said, "it doesn't necessarily follow, what you were saying is correct, it doesn't necessarily follow that they would go to a secure facility. It does necessarily follow that they would become a matter for the court." CHAIRMAN BUNDE added, "if it is appropriate." Number 0504 SCOTT CALDER testified next via teleconference from Fairbanks. He said HB 45 makes sense. He said, "It seems odd that in the process of correcting problems with the state's juvenile social service industry that we would omit to correct the problem of asking for the minor's permission to return home." He said this harkens back to the old days when there were problems in that regard. He referred to the other issue raised about what will happen when the minor returns or if the minor runs again and added that there are probably miles to go before we succeed in correcting those problems in the system. He said it would probably be a good idea to keep this one aspect fairly simple. Number 0579 AL NEAR testified next via teleconference from Fairbanks. He said he also favored HB 45 and it should pass as it corrects a little technical error. He said he wanted to make some comments about secure placement because he did not feel the existing laws provide for this possibility. He commented that despite our best efforts this runaway youth problem continues to plague the state. Responsible parents are trying to instill traditional values, but they encounter legal roadblocks. If a kid chooses to leave home as a runaway, there is little a parent can do and kids know this. He said laws are designed to protect abused and neglected children, but rebellious kids exploit these laws. MR. NEAR said that young people, who at an earlier time would have been held accountable for these misdeeds, can now exercise adult freedoms unencumbered by responsibility. Alaska needs the option of secure treatment facilities. At present families have few choices and some families are sending their children to programs outside the state. He said this situation could have occurred because of mandates, from federal legislation occurring in the 1970s, requiring least restrictive settings. He said we assume that some kids running away are fleeing abusive homes. In some cases this is true, but it overlooks the merely rebellious kids who would exploit these laws and manipulate the system. Kids who know the law enforcement agencies don't aggressively pursue them as runaways. He urged the legislature and the Administration to consider lifting this ban against secure placement for habitual runaways. Number 0755 STEVE GRUNSTEIN, Representative, Guardians of Family Justice an organization out of North Pole, said he supports the change proposed in HB 45. As a father of a teenage son here in Juneau a few years ago, he experienced the amalgamation of laws concerning juveniles. The current laws that have been on the books for the past number of years are non-functional. If we are serious about dealing with this juvenile problem, making some headway with it and stopping situations like people being shot at in Lemon Creek. He said we all know juveniles are putting gangs together left and right around the state. He said it all falls back to the early laws of the 1970s, the federal mandates, "you will not restrict your child." He supports HB 45's provision that the juvenile in question should not have the authority to veto or over-ride his parent's decision. MR. GRUNSTEIN said his organization supports the change proposed in HB 45. It is a technical, typographical error and because of it juveniles are given extreme authority over the parents. This is frustrating to the parents and everyone else. He said if a child goes out and does something wrong the state tends to come down on the parents, asking them why they aren't controlling their child. If any of the committee has had children out of control and had to face the law like a brick wall, you would know what it's like. MR. GRUNSTEIN said federal funding keeps the state from having secured environments for these children and said they can keep their federal funding. He said parents want to have control and authority over raising their children without living in fear of the Gestapo. He said when you run into the Division of Family and Youth Services (DFYS) where they suspect you have abused your child because you grounded him, you are dealing with something similar to the Gestapo the way you can be treated. Number 0893 ANGELA SALERNO, Executive Director, National Association of Social Workers, Alaska Chapter, said she is here as an advocate for vulnerable groups. She said she understood the history of HB 45 and what has been done or what has been attempted to be done around successfully addressing the problem issue of runaway youth. She said she was here specifically to speak to the issue of sexual and physical abuse of youth in the home. Her concern is that the provisions of HB 45 might increase the incidence of sexual, physical and emotional abuse in the home. This measure proposed in HB 45 would require a police officer to forcibly return a youth to his or her home against their will, without their consent. She said they may be returned to a home that is unsafe. MS. SALERNO said concerned parents, engaged parents do feel out of control. She said their testimony and their involvement shows their concern. She said she is more concerned about those families in which the parents are not engaged, in which the parents are abusive. She said she is fearful that we could increase the incidence of abuse and (indisc.) severe or fatal injuries to children. This bill's exception to forcible return when the officer might have reasonable cause to believe that there is sexual abuse does not take into account the fact that police officers are not trained to access sexual abuse and must rely on reports from the youth. She did not feel that all youth will be able to reveal abuse to a police officer or to anyone they have just met, especially an authority figure. She said this was a concern of hers. MS. SALERNO said forcing runaway youth to return home is not going to get the state where we want to go with this. She expressed concern that it will not deter youth from running away, it could drive them underground where we would be unable to help them. Life on the street is not fun and she said kids are not running away just for the fun of it. Most kids who run away probably have good reason to do it. MS. SALERNO said, in Alaska, 1,900 adolescents are homeless annually. In HB 45, the parent can consent to not having their child brought home which brings up concerns about what we are calling "throw away youth". She thought that if more options, more resources or more services were made available to youth the great majority of runaway youth would access them. She said she is talking specifically about such things as independent living and transitional living programs. Education, job training, counseling and other things that would help these minors become self- sustaining. What we all want is responsible youth. We need to help them learn and obtain those skills that can make them more responsible. Number 1082 REPRESENTATIVE DYSON said in the political subdivision where he lives all the police officers have pretty good training in these areas. He suspected that this training was pretty good all the way around the state. He said any child who is abused, or even wants to abuse the process by accusing his parents of abusing him, only has to pick up the phone and call. There are a number of agencies including the 911 service which can be called. He said he was almost shocked by her accusation that HB 45 is going to increase the number of abused children and make life worse for them. Number 1120 MS. SALERNO said the assessment of sexual abuse victims is controversial, even in social work. Some feel that even social workers aren't equipped to assess these situations. She apologized for not knowing what training police officers get, she is relying on her knowledge of the specialized training that social workers get about sexual abuse. MS. SALERNO said there is a problem with some youth, who erroneously accuse their parents of sexual abuse. She said she is sure it happens in an attempt to manipulate the system, but clarified that she is talking about the kid who has been abused, intimidated and in a diminished capacity to advocate for themselves. Number 1178 REPRESENTATIVE DYSON said he never meant to suggest that police officers are capable of doing an assessment on sexual abuse victims. He said the officers are qualified to make at least a preliminary judgement about whether or not there is a possibility that the child is in danger and then refer it to another agency where there is an escalating level of training and capacity to do an assessment. Number 1200 CAM CARLSON testified next via teleconference from Fairbanks. She said she was absolutely in favor of the amendment to this piece of legislation and added that minors are not in the position to make this decision. She said she is thankful that social workers were not around when she was growing up because it could have really screwed her up. She said, as a headstrong kid, she would have used the system like kids are using it now. She is glad her parents were there and were telling her what was what. MS. CARLSON said she became involved in this issue as a result of knowing friends and neighbors, who had been destroyed by the system. She said letting a minor decide what is good, what is best and where he is going to live is ludicrous. She said there are rules and laws that provide for children who are sexually or physically abused. She said she would not have put up with the kinds of things her friends and neighbors put up with in trying to raise their kids and the interference that the state put in their way. She strongly encouraged the committee to pass HB 45 and take away "minor choice." Number 1294 REPRESENTATIVE BRIAN PORTER said it wasn't Senator Frank's bill that made this specific change, it was a bill sponsored the year before, in 1994, by Senator Phillips that came to the House Judiciary Standing Committee. He said the judiciary committee put this provision into Senator Phillip's bill as a result of the kinds of problems that you have heard about today. He questioned how this language remained in statute as it was changed in 1994. He said police officers do get very good training in making initial evaluations as to whether a child has been abused or is the subject of abuse. He said there are literally scores of children who are manipulating the system with this "blackjack" that they have over parents to be able to say, "I get my way or I don't come home." He said this intimidation should not be allowed. He thought this issue was corrected in 1994. REPRESENTATIVE PORTER said the last juvenile runaway case that he remembered handling, as a police officer, was a 16-year-old girl who ran away from home because her mother wouldn't let her smoke and the teenager wasn't going to return until her mother let her smoke. He offered that this is the more typical case than the abused case. Number 1383 REPRESENTATIVE PORTER made a motion to move proposed Amendment 1 to HB 45. Hearing no objection it was adopted. Number 1396 REPRESENTATIVE KELLY said Amendment 1 sets an effective date. He said because this issue was supposed to be addressed in 1994 and survived 1996, they are worried about the backlog. Number 1405 REPRESENTATIVE AL VEZEY made a motion to move CSHB 45(HES). CHAIRMAN BUNDE asked if there was an objection. Hearing none, CSHB 45(HES) was moved out of the House Health, Education and Social Services Standing Committee with individual recommendations and attached zero fiscal notes.
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